View topic - Bilge pump for tripping

It is currently December 10th, 2019, 10:34 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 22 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
Author Message
PostPosted: March 29th, 2010, 11:17 pm 
Offline

Joined: October 2nd, 2002, 7:00 pm
Posts: 1155
Location: seattle, Washington USA
Elvstrom or Bernoulli effect bailers are great if you're going fast enough. But when you're not, water comes in. As far as the electric pump idea goes, what the other posters have said about conditions and the ability to clear the boat with even two pumps, is an issue. If you fill the boat on, for instance, the Nahanni, you are going to want to stop before you tackle those next big waves. The pumps will not, IMHO, clear the boat fast enough to help. You'll still have a filled boat, which will be lower in the water and will consequently take on water more easily. The other issue, is simplicity. There are several critical failure points on an electric pump. A bailer with a hole in it, even your hat, will clear water quickly. No battery to fail, pump to clog, no wires to come loose.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: March 30th, 2010, 9:54 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: February 19th, 2004, 9:53 pm
Posts: 1451
Location: Atlanta
Your other points are valid, but wait until you see a good electric pump setup in action before you conclude they are too slow. They are slower than dumping, when dumping is possible, but faster than bailing or hand pumping by a large margin.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: March 30th, 2010, 11:10 am 
Offline

Joined: October 2nd, 2002, 7:00 pm
Posts: 1155
Location: seattle, Washington USA
Hi EZ, I've seen the electric pumps work well in OC-1's. However, I think the original poster wanted to clear a large tripping boat in overwhelming conditions. Certainly there are bilge pumps that will do this quickly, but they are bigger than the ones commonly used for OC-1's.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: March 30th, 2010, 2:28 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: January 10th, 2005, 3:03 pm
Posts: 198
Location: Wilmington, Ma
rhumline wrote:
ezwater wrote:
I think rhumline is referring to a Bernoulli effect pump built into the bottom of the boat. They have been used by marathon racers for decades. To work, the boat has to be going fast enough that the water moving past the hull will pull water out through the drop-down chute.


You are correct sir, and I agree it really wouldn't work in a white water situ.

I still have a brand new one I picked up in the mid '80's. It never got installed in my marathon boat and I keep thinking I'll put it in the next tripping boat I make, but just hate to cut the hole.

Ken


I've often wondered if such a bailer would remove water while surfing a wave? Then all you would have to do is catch a wave while swamped and stay on it while opening the bailer then close the bailer before you got blown off. Whew! Possible in theory at least. :rofl:


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: March 30th, 2010, 5:20 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: February 19th, 2004, 9:53 pm
Posts: 1451
Location: Atlanta
erich, when one starts to take a lot of water into a tripping boat, one turns on the pump. One does not wait until the boat is full of water to capacity. This also applies with whitewater boats. The worst case scenario is that a whitewater OC-1 flips, and the paddler rolls it upright. Some of the water dumps out during the roll, but plenty is left. In a couple of minutes, a pump can remove enough water that the paddler has nearly full control of the boat.

The only issues regarding pumps for tandem trippers are, whether the liklihood of swamping is sufficient to look for a better solution than a hand pump, whether one is willing to carry the extra weight of a pump and battery, and whether one has a means to recharge the battery during a long trip. (Don't cite bailers or sponges, because in a loaded boat, neither is effective.)

Now, I think most tandem trippers don't expect to swamp in the middle of a big lake, and therefore they are unwilling to pay for a pump system and to carry the pump and battery across portages. But on certain kinds of trips, such as going along the north shore of Lake Superior, a pump system may make sense, and there are solar recharging systems that can keep the battery up to speed.

So the answer in my opinion is that most tandem trippers don't need a battery pump, but a few might want to give it serious consideration.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: April 14th, 2010, 11:21 am 
Offline

Joined: March 1st, 2008, 11:50 am
Posts: 32
I use an electric pump in my OC1. With the airbags and me in the boat, there is little free space, and the pump works great. I love it. In a tripping tandem, with all that extra volume, even with dual pumps, I would question how useful it would be. If I was ever going to try it, it would be in combination with a spraydeck, since I think a spray deck would be far more effect alone then a pump would, but maybe there would be some advantage in the combination.

What I have been wondering is how useful a pump would be on the ocean or large lake for emergencies in combination with a spraydeck. After practicing canoe reentry techniques in calm water, I have to wonder how effective they are in rough water where there is a real possibility of capsizing. Boats half full of water are unstable and trying to paddle to shore or bail in conditions serious enough to flip, seems unrealistic to me. Just keeping the darn boat upright can be hard enough. However, doing your best to keep a half full boat upright while some gizmo does the bailing for you, and a spraydeck preventing at least some of the water from coming back in again, might give you a better chance.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: October 22nd, 2010, 2:03 pm 
Offline

Joined: April 7th, 2010, 9:14 am
Posts: 1
I thought that I would weigh in on this topic. I have two boats a C1 play boat and a Pocket Canyon, both with electric bilge pumps. I can not say enough about either setup; in the C1 I have a single 1200 GPH pump located behind the saddle. and in the Canyon I have 2 1200GPH pumps under the rear seat.

I tinkered with both set-ups for a while, I think I am nearly complete with the current config. I have a single 12v 5500 mAh Nickel Metal Hydrate battery which can be used for both boats. If fits within a small pelican case with a waterproof switch and outlet so that it hooks into the pumps. With the single pump the battery works for a few hours total run time or a few days of actual paddling. This time is cut in half with the double pump set up.

The hosing and wiring is all tucked away neatly and has never caused me any problems (snagging, etc.) The pumps and batteries have never been damaged or caused any issue either. All in all it comes down to the placement of all of the components.

All in all the pump wasn’t a lot of cash to buy things and piece it together. 30$ for the pump, 10$ for hose wiring through hull spout and other connectors, 20$ for the pelican case and 70$ for battery and charger. I know that you can buy some boats (esquif) with a pre-installed pump for around 300$ extra. From seeing these pumps I don’t think they are as good or are built with the same quality parts...

The performance of the pumps is good, if you are expecting to have your boat dry instantly you are going to be disappointed. There is always going to be a bit (1/2") of water in the bottom of the boat and it takes some time, around 1 minute to drain out the full C-1... Really its perfect for getting the water out when you have to focus on other things or keep paddling. In the Tandem boat the performance is about the same, but it really depends on the loading of your boat and the placement of the pumps.

Looking back I might change the placement of the pumps in both boats - moving the pumps forward – in front of the saddle in the c1 and right in front of the stern seat where the cage for the float bag is installed. I would most likely change where the hose exits the boat as well, in the front of the C1 and in the middle of the tandem. The other advice I would give to anyone putting a system together is to go with a very large pump 1200gph with at least a 1 1/8" bilge hose.

Hopefully this helps!


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 22 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

All times are UTC - 5 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group