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PostPosted: October 10th, 2019, 7:08 pm 
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Location: Toronto, Ontario Canada
A friend of mine bought a used Escalade, if nothing else it's a heavy duty build with great clearance. Other than brief family hand me downs I've always bought new vehicles, I'm pretty sure that will never be the case again given current prices.

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PostPosted: October 12th, 2019, 8:44 am 
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Location: Freeland, Maryland USA
Martin, whatever you decide don’t overlook the advantage of being able to sleep overnight in the vehicle.

I just got back from an 8 day trip in the Adirondacks. Actually a 9 day trip, instead of leaving home at 4am, driving 9 hours and then hurriedly paddling in to find a site and set up before dark I left well after rush hour, drove part way there, slept in the back of the truck overnight and arrived at the put in early in the day.

Other advantages; heavy rains were forecast that evening, night and into the next morning. Instead of making a 9 hour drive in the pouring rain I pulled into a State Park in New York the evening before, threw the 10x13 truck tarp over the boat and cap (6 guy lines and stakes, no poles) so I could leave the windows open with a covered “back porch” at the tailgate and left the next morning for a more pleasant last couple hours drive to the put in and a morning launch.

ImagePA010020 by Mike McCrea, on Flickr

Yes, that is an extension cord and 110V fan. It was 87f when I arrived at the park and never cooled off much that night.


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PostPosted: October 12th, 2019, 12:38 pm 
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Mike McCrea wrote:
Martin, whatever you decide don’t overlook the advantage of being able to sleep overnight in the vehicle.



Besides quick overnight stops in actual parks there are other places you can park & sleep overnight. Places like truck stops and even many Walmart parking lots!

https://www.walmartlocator.com/rv-parking-at-walmart/

In Ontario roadside rest areas ban overnight stops and police will roust you if they find you parked Midnight to 6:00am but you can pull in there at 7:00am and sleep in the back for 4 or 5 hours undisturbed. Also in Ontario (probably elsewhere) the Green P commuter lots near big cities like Toronto allow (free) overnight parking, although not intended for "camping" you can park a pick-up truck and get a nice lengthy sleep in the back and never get a hassle of any kind.

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PostPosted: October 16th, 2019, 3:17 pm 
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Location: Freeland, Maryland USA
recped wrote:
Besides quick overnight stops in actual parks there are other places you can park & sleep overnight. Places like truck stops and even many Walmart parking lots! .


I have a friend who does a lot of self-contained live-aboard cross country trips, and he does the Walmart thing on occasion. Seems safe parked between some RV’s at the far end of the lot, and a 24 hour WalllyWorld has rest rooms and is open for dawn grub replenishment and at least bad coffee.

Thanks for the locator link, I saved it for possible future use.

recped wrote:
In Ontario roadside rest areas ban overnight stops and police will roust you if they find you parked Midnight to 6:00am but you can pull in there at 7:00am and sleep in the back for 4 or 5 hours undisturbed. Also in Ontario (probably elsewhere) the Green P commuter lots near big cities like Toronto allow (free) overnight parking, although not intended for "camping" you can park a pick-up truck and get a nice lengthy sleep in the back and never get a hassle of any kind.


Good to know. Back in the ‘70’s and 80’s I caught needed zees in all manner of places; rest areas, truck stops, even wide spot pull offs on backcountry road two lanes. I am not that bold anymore, and like to know that I am largely legal. I was only rousted once in 30 years of scarfing free sleep, snoring under the truck cap waiting for the morning’s first Ocracoke Ferry to arrive. Seriously Mr. Terminal dude, it’s 6am and the first ferry arrives at 7:00; I was waking up soon anyway.

I will still pick up a US National Forest Service or BLM map when entering a wildness area, have a look at the dirt road squiggles and just make all left hand turns until the goat track ends. I don’t guess anyone is coming back here to roust me tonight. I should be good making all right hand turns back to pavement, but somehow in the pre-dawn dark, not always. Oops, where the hell am I?

I don’t mind paying a few bucks for a primitive site, and will cough up the $20 bucks for a State Park campsite with picnic table on which to organize gear, and bathhouse shower to scrub off the road stank, especially if it is near my route, seems interesting or has day paddling opportunities. There are some awesome and unique environments preserved in US State Parks, well worth the fees. Places like Valley of Fire State Park in Nevada.

http://parks.nv.gov/parks/valley-of-fire

For US travel this book will pay for itself with the first few cheap nights stay. Free and Low-Cost Campgrounds

https://www.amazon.com/Camping-Americas ... 0937877557

12,000 US “campgrounds”, many primitive free, or less than the $12 a night maximum listing criteria. If it is near enough off my route, free or $5 a night, with a pit toilet, no water, no electric, no hook up, and hence no RV neighbors, I’m all the happier. Might even stay an extra day if it is an interesting area.

Most of my favorite, obscure, up-a-dirt primitive campsites are in that book. No idea if there is a similar Canadian version.


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PostPosted: October 17th, 2019, 12:48 pm 
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Location: Freeland, Maryland USA
On a recent trip another friend did the sleepover truck bit, and set up a “back porch” tarp before the rainy night and morning, paddling in the next day. He is more knowledgeable about the area, knew of a backwoods place to park and sleep away the rainy night, and packed an little used Kelty tarp as a back porch.

ImagePA020002 by Mike McCrea, on Flickr

He was smitten with the tailgate porch idea, and is far more ingenious than I. He has his thinking cap on about making a cut-to-size-and-shape, quick connect back porch awning for his truck.

I have thought about the possibility of using a self-furling awning from a junked RV, attached under the rear crossbar, will be interested in his solution. Maybe looking to copy some design form and function ideas.

BTW, tarp as back porch rain protection, absolutely. But truck camped out in the open desert or a coastal beach site the back porch shade and sun reflectivity of the 10 x 13 green/silver Yuedge tarp is equally beneficial. It covers the entire cap and open side windows for reflective shade and open window ventilation, perhaps even more valuable to keep the sun off a dark colored cap in blazing summer sun.

https://www.amazon.com/YUEDGE-13-Rain-F ... B071WP2QJW


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PostPosted: November 11th, 2019, 2:33 pm 
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Joined: April 6th, 2007, 8:42 pm
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It took a while, but we bought a vehicle. Plans for long road-trips involving skiing, paddling, and lounging with a view made cargo-carrying capacity and sleeping inside the vehicle high priorities. We opted for a Dodge Grand Caravan. No 4WD or high clearance, but lots of space. We're in the process now of outfitting her with a double bed and storage totes. Trailer hitch and roof racks are on the "Must-do List", but will have to wait till after our first road trip starting as soon as we can get packed. We're slow movers. Thanks to everyone here whose ideas helped kick-start our plan to "get-'er-done".


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PostPosted: November 11th, 2019, 6:13 pm 
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Location: Kanata
Martin,
As soon as I clicked to read your update, in my mind I was thinking Grand Caravan, that's what we have and I love it! Just bought our second one. First one died at just about 300k. Can't wait to see the pics.

rab


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PostPosted: November 14th, 2019, 1:29 pm 
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The vehicle I've favoured for these kinds of adventures is the Jeep Cherokee/Grand Cherokee/XJ with the reliable 4.0L inline six. Judging by the number of them around, and how well used they are, they're popular. Parts, and parts vehicles are easy to find. The downside is they get poor mileage, the upside is they're almost unstoppable.

Tarp mounting... awning-track is inexpensive, and an appropriate sized rope (1/4”?), sewn into the tarp edge, allows it to be fed into the track and held securely.


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PostPosted: February 14th, 2020, 10:01 pm 
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Joined: August 28th, 2013, 7:44 pm
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Thule racks on my cap and cab, and a telescopic canoe loader attachment on the back bar. I walk up ahead of the back bar, walk backwards so the stern rests on the extension, and then lift the bow onto the cab racks. It's dicey in the wind, but otherwise totally doable alone with a 70# Clipper Tripper S.

https://flic.kr/p/ooymyo


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PostPosted: February 15th, 2020, 2:06 pm 
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Location: Freeland, Maryland USA
seano3ca wrote:
Thule racks on my cap and cab, and a telescopic canoe loader attachment on the back bar. I walk up ahead of the back bar, walk backwards so the stern rests on the extension, and then lift the bow onto the cab racks. It's dicey in the wind, but otherwise totally doable alone with a 70# Clipper Tripper S.


I have a slide out Thule “Outrigger” bar on my truck cap racks, but it is on the front bar, extending out the right hand side.

https://www.thule.com/en-us/sport-rack/ ... ii-_-16192

With the extension on the front bar I can walk up beside the truck under the yoke, forward aimed and set the bow on the extension while facing my work and watching what I am doing.

Extended out from the passenger side for ease and safety on day trips; loading/unloading on small streams I may be parked alongside the road at a (hopefully) wide shoulder near a bridge crossing. Doing that with my ass and the canoe hanging out in passing traffic, no thanks. YMMV in the UK, Ireland, Malta or Cypus.

I don’t use the extension bar all the time, I can more easily load our open boats resting the bow on the rear crossbar, stepping out and sliding forward into the unchanged (still prefect fore and aft positioned) bow gunwale-stopped position, and then slide and tighten clamp a single gunwale stop quickly across the back crossbar to trap the stern in place.

Wind can always be an issue when solo racking a canoe, another reason I like having four gunwale stops, two for the bow, two for the stern. Sliding or dropping the canoe inside those gunwale traps provides some wind resistance, and getting the first belly line across in the wind is less frantic.

One of the reasons I really like “load stops”, besides being less expensive than “gunwale brackets”, is that with some DIY paddling they can be slid tightly into place, cushion compressed around the outwales, helping holding the canoe in place.

ImageP9180028 by Mike McCrea, on Flickr

That cushioned Thule Load Stop padding is narrow scraps of leftover exercise flooring, contact cemented with a bead of E-6000 around the edges. Those stops are easily removable/reversible in orientation; most “gunwale brackets” have a single orientation, and some are a PITA to take off or even adjust.

Shouldered hulls works best with the \ angled side inwards against the outwale edge, slab sided boats work better with the | vertical side facing the hull.


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PostPosted: February 17th, 2020, 12:43 am 
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Mike McCrea, I tried the bow-first load, but struggled with the gorilla lift when most of the weight of the canoe was behind my shoulders. I didn't feel good resting the stern deck plate on the ground and turning around to achieve a better lift to put the stern on the truck. Working by feel hasn't always been perfect, as a couple of marks on the truck will attest, but at 13 years old now, it doesn't owe me much, and those marks aren't the worst it has. :) I sometimes worry at how far apart the racks are, but never enough to move the feet.

I have managed to avoid loading/unloading on roadway shoulders most of the time, except along forestry roads where traffic is sparse and easy to hear coming. I'd be taking a different approach if I was on a busier roadside for sure.

I love the load stops - I've thought about buying gunwale brackets, but always cheaped out. Load stops will be on for the coming season for sure.


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PostPosted: February 17th, 2020, 12:45 pm 
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seano3ca wrote:
I tried the bow-first load, but struggled with the gorilla lift when most of the weight of the canoe was behind my shoulders. I didn't feel good resting the stern deck plate on the ground and turning around to achieve a better lift to put the stern on the truck.


I’m old, worn down and oft-aching (blown L2/L3). Loading with the extension bar, or sliding on via the rear crossbar, I opt to rest the bow on a crossbar, step out unencumbered, straighten up as my spine creaks and cracks, then walk to the stern and shift the hull between the crossbar stops. Your age, back and mileage may vary.

I do the same hoisting the canoe off the ground to get under the yoke; picking up just the bow, forward of center, and shuffling back under shoulders in the yoke. The stern tip on all of our boats with vinyl deck plates show some years of contact with rocks or pavement.

ImageP1210076 by Mike McCrea, on Flickr

Always on the stern, the bow deck plates are near virginal.

ImageP1210077 by Mike McCrea, on Flickr

That canoe is 15 years old; I figure I’ll be 105 before I need to replace the stern deck plate.

I am more considerate with our wood deck plates or composite tipped decked boats. I know approximately where the stem will rest on the ground when I set the bow in place and lay down a pad, even a truck floor mat will suffice.

seano3ca wrote:
I love the load stops - I've thought about buying gunwale brackets, but always cheaped out. Load stops will be on for the coming season for sure.


I am a huge fan for THAT style Thule Load Stop, especially the adaptive cushion tightened and smushed around the outwale. I am less a fan of (used to be pricier) Thule or Yakima designed canoe gunwale brackets.

Those (square bar) Thule Load Stops may have been discontinued recently, but they are still available from resellers.The (replacement?) Thule Aero bar load stops or (crude) Yakima Load Stops are less useful for canoes,

https://www.thule.com/en-us/roof-rack/r ... -_-1683229

https://www.rei.com/product/150198/yaki ... lsrc=aw.ds

We have Thule and Yakima “gunwale stops” from years gone by. Their edges are all vertical, and with flared or shouldered tumblehome hulls, or decked canoe cockpits, are best used with the stops positioned INSIDE the hull, facing outwards. That is an awkward place to adjust and tighten stops, high and tight between the roof line and rack, especially with a taller rack. Bring a step ladder.

One downside to gunwale brackets or load stops. Each Thule Load Stop occludes 3” of crossbar (two canoes will assuredly not be rubbing together) , even the shorter Gunwale Bracket designs take up 2” of space apiece. If you are carrying two canoes, each trapped individually fore and aft, that is four stops per bar; you have already sacrificed 12” of crossbar width just for stops.

Carrying two tandems, even on 78” bars, means that some (or all) of the load stops need to go inside the hull.

I am not sure the corporate manufacturer design-teams are really much considering actual canoeist crossbar spacing needs. There are dozens of designed cradles, J-bars, rollers and Hulluvators for kayaks, and damned little choice for open boaters.

There must be a better way, better designed canoe gunwale stops; something narrower, something that takes up less valuable racks crossbar space, something still easily removed/reoriented between flat | and angled / sides, with a bit of compressed cushion for the pushin’.

Eh, let’s think up with a dozen kayak, ski and snow boards designs instead. First manufacturer that comes up with a thoughtful 2-boat canoeist design has my business.


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PostPosted: June 3rd, 2020, 5:41 pm 
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Bumping this thread, I'm a full time Taco-cult member,

I've got a Prinsu rack up top, which lets me bolt on all kinds of fun things..
I use malone brackets to keep our boat safe and secure up top, I've had to create a lift on the rear mounts to account for the rocker in our Prospector.. but once it's up there it is not going anywhere.

Image

[url=https://flic.kr/p/KhgF3N]Image

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PostPosted: June 5th, 2020, 8:32 pm 
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I am pretty sure that carrying canoes on car and truck roofs was simpler and easier in the good old days, i.e. when vehicles had rain gutters and microwave ovens hadn't been invented yet.
I just had my trailer hitch installed on the Grand Caravan. Its maiden trip pulling a canoe trailer with side-by-side boats on it to the local reservoir was accomplished without incident. That was step one. Now for Step 2: roof racks ON the roof of the vehicle. WTF! How can it be so complicated?!

Option 1: Old Thule system (but purchased new out of elusive old stock) with 78" crossbars (old stock to fit discontinued #460 Traverse set 28" apart with attachment points at the front and rear of the rear sliding doors. Thule seems to have discontinued the long bars for its Traverse series. Thule's declared max. weight for this configuration on my vehicle: 88 lbs. What!? My paddles weigh more than that! Cost: around $500-600 CAN. tax in.

Option 2: Thule "Top-Tracks" TP 54" installed with screws and sealer on minivan's bare flat roof to provide the vehicle with rails. Add to the rails Thule Podium Fit Kit 3101 and 79" "pro-bars" to allow a bigger space between crossbars and an improved max. 165lb. carrying. Price installed__GULP! : $1282 CAN. from the Rack Attack. Needless to say, I was too stunned to even ask if that was tax included.

That would take a lot of days carrying skis and canoes to make that cost-effective. Option 2 brings to mind the story of the 90-year-old great grandaddy all in a tizzy over whether to replace his roof shingles with the 20-year-guarantee version or the 30-year-guarantee version. Um, let's see, ah, is there a 3-year guarantee version? And no, I don't want to spend my remaining paddling days hauling canoes on foam blocks with straps coming in through my windows. Those straps could interfere with my view of the road, or worse, leave lines of red welts on my throat while allowing raindrops to migrate in along the straps and drip down upon my lap. Yes, in desperation I did consider the thrifty foam block PITA solution. But no. I deserve better. Just not $1200 better...

So am I missing out there the REASONABLE version of a modern-day roof rack that stays on the minivan most of the year and carries a narrow ski-and-paddle cargo box with plenty of room beside it for a 36" wide canoe with all the trimmings?


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PostPosted: June 6th, 2020, 9:04 am 
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Can you get a factory roof rack from a wrecker and have it installed on your van and then go from there?


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